Kuja
RPG Townie
I have no idea what that was meant to be ^^^
Posts: 887
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Post by Kuja on May 12, 2003 14:33:37 GMT -5
I was pondering this question today. Now, although i am an atheist is it possible for me to go to heaven?
I dont believe that there is one which would mean I have no faith but if I were to abide by the 10 commandments for my entire life or feel genuine remorse when I broke one would I go to heaven?
(Im interested in hearing the opinions of christians on this matter. But please, this thread isnt to discuss the rights or wrongs of christianity which has been done so many times before)
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Post by The~Inquisitor on May 12, 2003 14:46:34 GMT -5
There's no such thing.
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Fredbez
RPG Townie
Satanist 0wnage
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Post by Fredbez on May 12, 2003 16:29:51 GMT -5
small minded but correct oh man am I gonna burn...
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Post by SleepyTemplar on May 12, 2003 16:34:03 GMT -5
There's no heaven to concern yourself with. However...
If you're wondering in the context of Christianity if, as an atheist, you would go to their heaven, the answer is no. Enterance to heaven in Christianity isn't based upon one's conduct, but whether you believe in Jesus as the son of God. John 14:6 puts this forth. I believe Jacket will say something similar.
It's this kind of thinking that leads to the infamous and poorly thought out Pascal's wager.
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Varzael
RPG Town Newbie
Cogito ergo s<c>um
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Post by Varzael on May 12, 2003 19:18:41 GMT -5
What you really mean is ''if one is an atheist does the christianic dogma allows him/her to go to heaven?''.
However you should also tell us if you are talking about the catholics' heaven,the anglikans' heaven,the yehovites',the mysticist christians' or the orthodox' one?You see each christian dogma has different ''rules'' and restrictions.
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Post by SleepyTemplar on May 13, 2003 0:34:07 GMT -5
Considering the basis of Christian dogma is the Bible, I believe the reasoning for what I said was well supported.
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Super Koopa
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Protector of the n00bs
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Post by Super Koopa on May 13, 2003 1:06:31 GMT -5
Well, being a Jew.
Oh yeah.. To continue.
being a Jew, my faith believes that everyone gets into Heaven. Basically, there is no hell. So pretty much, being a Jew only gets you into heaven faster.
1st people in - Jews 2nd People in - Bad Jews 3rd People in - Other religions 4th people in - Christians Waiting in line for eternity - Jew haters
Now that last part was a bit of a joke.. so don't take it too seriously.
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Post by The~Inquisitor on May 13, 2003 4:51:14 GMT -5
Didn't "Jesus" supposedly die on the cross to allow us all go into "heaven"? "Waiting in line for eternity - Jew haters" Hitler will be in line for a while then.
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Maxy
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Posts: 187
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Post by Maxy on May 13, 2003 9:39:55 GMT -5
Jesus died to save mankind, not to send us all to heaven. God always wanted mankind to save itself. Bad people still burn. Christians believe they are the one true religion and everyone else are heretics. They're narrow-minded that way. Other religions accept Christianity, as they believe it is the same religion, just worshiped in a different way. Christianity has never been one for tolerance.
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Varzael
RPG Town Newbie
Cogito ergo s<c>um
Posts: 8
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Post by Varzael on May 13, 2003 18:57:37 GMT -5
First of all not all christian dogmas accept the bible as their base,like mysticist or apokryphistic christianism.
But apart from them Templar all dogmas (mis-)interpret the bible each to its own best interest.They take out lines of it and shower it with rhetorics to give out what they want to.So you can be a member of the witnesses of Jehova and according to its dogma be on ypour way to heaven and at the same time be a heathen for catholics or another dogma.
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celticshiva
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"Cross me once, shame on you. Cross me twice, shame on me." --Mr. Scott
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Post by celticshiva on May 18, 2003 14:29:45 GMT -5
But apart from them Templar all dogmas (mis-)interpret the bible each to its own best interest.They take out lines of it and shower it with rhetorics to give out what they want to.So you can be a member of the witnesses of Jehova and according to its dogma be on ypour way to heaven and at the same time be a heathen for catholics or another dogma. Some Christian churches also use different translations of The Bible, which have different meanings in some of the verses. Using the above example of the Jehovah's Witnesses, they use the New World Testament, a translation that only that religion uses because they believe it's the most accurate translation. The Jehovah's witnesses believe that those who die before Armageddon will go to paradise on earth. Those that are still live at Armageddon that do not call out on Jesus' name will 'die the second death' and cease to exist (there is no hell). Those that break the laws while in Paradise will also die the second death, everyone is perfect at this point so this should never happen. (Yes according to their teachings even Hitler will be given a chance in Paradise.) Now here's the thing.. only 144,000 chosen people go to New Jerusalem in Heaven to serve Jesus and God directly. The rest of the world lives on earth in a perfect paradise. The Jehovah's Witnesses believe this is how God intended us to live. However, if the Earth is a perfect paradise, is it really any different then the classic concept of 'Heaven'? I was raised a Jehovah's Witness, but I am no longer Christian of any sort.
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Post by The Jacket on May 18, 2003 23:36:23 GMT -5
I'm rather busy and don't intend to stay on this topic, so let me make a couple of very quick statements.
No.
John 3:3 "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
Actually, Jehova's Witnesses are about as much Christian as Mormons are.
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Atolmazel
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"That's one spicy tamale"
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Post by Atolmazel on May 20, 2003 16:26:59 GMT -5
Its said in John, and repeated in Corinthians by Paul that the only way to heaven is through belief in the ressurection. There are no other prerequisites. Sleepy was correct in his description. Maxy, you talk about christians being narrow-minded. Have you ever considered that perhaps it is not because they haven't explored other options but rather that they believe they have found the truth? There are several beliefs that are completly incompatible with Christianity; why should a christian say that other religions are true if it is utterly against their belief? This doesn't make them narrow-minded, it makes them devoted.
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Post by SleepyTemplar on May 20, 2003 17:10:40 GMT -5
Indeed. The "narrow-minded" claim doesn't work well, since for something to be true, it must exclude other things which are false. The better claim is that Christians lack support to claim their beliefs as true.
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Atolmazel
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"That's one spicy tamale"
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Post by Atolmazel on May 20, 2003 20:41:55 GMT -5
Indeed. The "narrow-minded" claim doesn't work well, since for something to be true, it must exclude other things which are false. The better claim is that Christians lack support to claim their beliefs as true. I'm glad you bring some unbias sense to the atheist scene, Sleepy. Half the time it seems as if its either 'they are wrong because they're evil and narrow-minded' or 'they are wrong because of pain and suffering'.
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